Freestyle (Rap) + Philosophy with Brenton Zola
About the Episode
When someone talks about “philosophy” do you automatically envision old white guys with graying beards? I mean, probably? But what if Tupac is the greatest wisdom teacher of our time? What can rap teach us about life’s deepest questions? And, if they were still alive, would we find Aristotle and Plato at the nearest hip hop jam session?
My guest today is here to talk to us all about it.
Episode Details
About Brenton (he/him)
Brenton Zola uses the power of words to cultivate humanity. He is a writer, thinker, and multi-disciplinary artist. Informed by an upbringing from Congolese immigrants and travel to over 60 nations, his writing and creative work blend narrative, philosophy, and history to examine how we build ethical societies. His work has appeared in The New York Times, Newsweek, LA Times, Inc., American Theater, Boulevard Magazine, Prism, and on NPR member-station WBUR Boston and PBS, among others. His professional journey started with living at a meditation and martial arts school in Asia, which led to work through social impact and the arts. Brenton has been an artist-in-residence at theaters and collectives worldwide and serves as a curator for the Tilt West Journal. He is a Moth story slam champion, a proud member of Playback Theatre West & Storytellers Acapella, and a TEDx speaker and organizer at one of the world’s largest events. He believes truth can be found at the intersection of disciplines and stories.
What We Discuss
The tension between “intelligence” and “creativity.”
His mom’s love of Tupac, where his love of rap began.
How he defines “philosophy.”
What philosophy brings to the table that science doesn’t.
Rap as resistance and a demand for equality.
What Brenton calls “smashing atoms” and why he loves it.
A story about his time in speech and debate, a kind of freestyle performance, and his first early foray into mixing disciplines together.
How the Greek “stoa” was the ancient version of the modern rap cipher.
Freestyle and philosophy as a practice of spotting patterns and making interesting connections.
The value of a public forum for debating ideas, and how rap still practices this tradition.
Brenton’s current favorite “atom smashers,” rappers, and all-time favorite philosophers.
And, a closing freestyle rap!
Sources Mentioned
Here’s the Tupac meme Brenton mentioned.
We mention David Epstein a couple of times in this episode. He’s the author of a book called Range: Why Generalists Triumph in a Specialized World, and appears in Episode 005 of the podcast with me, which you can listen to here.
Tilt West, where Brenton and I met, promotes critical discourse focused on arts and culture through live events and publishing efforts. You can find out more about them here. You can actually listen to the entire recorded roundtable where Brenton and I met, a discussion on “Art & Language: Codes & Translation” from January 2020 here. I am the voice, surprise surprise, who mentions Arrival at one point. Natalie Lampert is the “Natalie” I’m referring to when talking about the roundtable; she’s a writer and author who was also in attendance.
Forgive me for citing from Wikipedia, but here’s some info on Greek “stoa,” where Brenton says philosophers used to hang out and jam on philosophical ideas and is the source of the word “Stoicism.”
Plato’s Symposium
Grow Local Colorado is the name of the organization that at least used to host gatherings of individuals from the local food community in Denver.
Ratatouille is the movie where Brenton jokes that it’s said, “Anyone can cook.”
Zeno is the founder of the Stoic school of philosophy, who Brenton mentions by name.
Here’s my favorite video about Epicurus, the philosopher that talked about building a life based on happiness.
interintellect is the group where Brenton hosted digital roundtable discussions, including the one with the neuroscientist.
Here’s one place where you can read more about griots, the West African oral storytellers that Brenton mentions.
Check out the work of Von Wong, the installation artist who repurposes plastic and other used goods into mythical photos. Here’s the trailer for “Curb Your Carbon,” the documentary with Von Wong, narrated by Ryan Reynolds.
Here’s the work of Max Stossel, the poet Brenton knows and loves who has worked at the Center for Humane Technology, featured in The Social Dilemma, as Brenton mentions.
Bo Burnham, the comedian.
The Experience House, where Brenton has been at their Morocco experience, the “laboratory” of multidisciplinary individuals.
Here’s another School of Life video, but on Heidegger, one of Brenton’s favorite philosophers, and here’s his book, Being and Time.
Our modern-day hip-hop philosopher, Kendrick Lamar.
Black Thought and Questlove from The Roots.
MC Solaar, the French rapper from the 90s and 2000s.
Aristotle (and his “Poetics”), Voltaire, Emerson, and Wittgenstein are who Brenton names as his favorite philosophers. Just Google them!
My first interview episode with Shannon Davies Mancus, where I mention a discussion on Chernobyl, the HBO series.
Richard Feynman is the famous theoretical physicist who Brenton calls a philosopher.
Here’s a link to Brenton’s episode of WBUR Boston’s Last Seen, called “Africa’s Lost Year of Hope.”
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Credits
Audio engineering by Joshua LaBure.
All of my music is provided by the in-house musicians at Slip.stream.
Episode Transcript
Coming soon, hopefully! Would you be willing to help? Email me at brandi@thisplusthat.com!
