Purpose + Illness with Charles Eisenstein & Lauren Buckley
About the Episode
When is illness a gift? When do the symptoms we experience in sickness and disease tell us we might actually be out of alignment with ourselves, or even with our “purpose”? Could global viruses even serve a similar function in warning us about a world out of alignment? Do the signals of joy, pain, or disease in our body—whether we consider them “good” or “bad”—serve to guide us in what is most “right” for us? Are the ailments we experience internally actually a reflection of the ailments we see going on externally, like with the environment or in our collective communities? Might all internal sickness actually be an indication of our deeper spiritual sicknesses?
These are heavy questions, right?
Questions that Charles Eisenstein, Lauren Buckley, and I have each contended with in our own experiences of sickness and disease. We’re all painfully familiar with the complexity of illness—both as physical challenges and as metaphors that might also speak to how we are individually and collectively “sick.”
So, in this episode, we discuss the connections of “Purpose + Illness.”
Episode Details
About Charles (he/him)
Charles Eisenstein is a writer and a speaker. His four main books are The Ascent of Humanity (2007), Sacred Economics (2011, revised 2020), The More Beautiful World our Hearts Know is Possible (2013), and Climate — A New Story (2018). All of them can be read online or purchased wherever books are sold. He lives in the part of the world that most people currently call Rhode Island, USA, in a smallish house about 20 minutes from the ocean and five minutes from the Great Swamp. He shares the house with his wife, Stella, son Cary, dog Inka, and some mice. He has three older sons, Jimi, Matthew, and Philip.
About Lauren (she/her)
Lauren Buckley is a seeker. Consumed with questions like “Who am I?”, “Why am I here?”, “Where did I come from?”, and “Where am I going?”, she has followed life wherever it seemed like she might find some insight.
For a while, science seemed like the best path to truth, so she enrolled in a biochemistry Ph.D. program at UC-Berkeley. But, during a Luce Scholars Fellowship in Thailand, a total physical and mental health collapse blew up her plans. After exhausting her options in mainstream medicine—to no avail—a desperate search for healing eventually led her to see the limitations and dogma of mainstream science, discover holistic medicine, work with #1 New York Times Bestseller Chris Kresser, and launch a wellness company.
The mystery illness continued and became a decade-long initiatory experience that drove Lauren deeper and deeper until it became clear that her healing journey goes all the way to the bottom—to the spiritual.
She is still on this path.
You can now find Lauren seeking out loud on Uncertain, where she goes deep with some of her favorite people on philosophy, psychology, spirituality, wellness, and whatever else is capturing her endless curiosity. It is a home for nerds who question everything, and for seekers of wisdom & healing.
What We Discuss
A new development in Brandi’s health journey—dental cavitation surgery and selling her house to afford it.
Sometimes listening to the fears of those around you as a normal and healthy instinct to determine whether we’re on the “right” track.
How often you can feel gaslit when experiencing chronic illness.
How physical conditions sometimes mirror our internal, spiritual conditions.
When illness can be a gift that helps us know when we’re out of alignment.
“Control” as a type of “illness.”
Planning as a type of living in separation from ourselves.
Letting what we truly want to do guide our decisions.
What we do or don’t “deserve” when it comes to health or living in a healthy society.
And, curiosity as a path of aliveness.
Sources Mentioned
Here’s a link to “Metaphysics & Mystery,” the course of Charles’ where Lauren appears, which I mention in the intro to this episode. And, here’s a link to my first episode, “Why This Matters to Me,” where you can hear me responding to Lauren after I watched the full intro video of the course.
Listen to my full, solo episode that came right before this interview with Charles and Lauren, where I provide more context to our chat and read things like my piece on “A Sick Society + An Individual Burden.”
Here’s an NCBI article on dental cavitations, but beware of the dental photos included. You’ve been warned. Most other links you’ll find on dental cavitations are straight from dental offices, which I hesitate to provide here because you might find them biased. If you’re interested in more, I suggest reading JAWS: The Story of a Hidden Epidemic, or Toxic Tooth, or watching Root Cause for free online.
The More Beautiful World Our Hearts Know is Possible and Sacred Economics are the two books from Charles I mention at the beginning of the chat.
The woman I saw post on Instagram about waking up and eating honey first thing each morning goes by the handle @conjuredcravings, and this is the post.
I believe Heal Your Body was the Louise Hay book that Charles said everyone knows about.
Alfred Korzybski and humans as “time binders" (links to a PDF).
The episode I mention where one of my guests asks me about what dualism teaches us, or how it serves us, is “Infinity + Nuance with Kendra Krueger.” Listen here.
You can find more on your body as a “compass” in pointing you toward aliveness and purpose in my episode with Andreas Weber, on “Love + Death.”
“Beyond Industrial Medicine” is the Substack article Brandi mentions from Charles.
“Life Colors: What the Colors in Your Aura Reveal,” the book Lauren mentioned.
Watch Online
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Find Charles Online
Website
Substack
YouTube
Twitter
A New and Ancient Story Podcast
CE Random Podcast
Find Lauren Online
Uncertain Instagram
Uncertain Might Network
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Credits
Filming (of Lauren & Brandi) by Kyle Buckley at KAB Agency
Audio engineering by the team at Upfire Digital.
All of my music is provided by the in-house musicians at Slip.stream.
Episode Transcript
Coming soon, hopefully! Would you be willing to help? Email me at brandi@thisplusthat.com!
